OCR!

I'm one of the other users checking this thread daily for news. I also ordered an iPhone 4 in anticipation of this feature. I wish I had this when I lived in China last year, but am looking forward to putting it through its paces in China next month if the stars are right and the feature makes it into the App Store by then.

Keep up the good work, Mike. I think Pleco already has an unbeatable reputation in the field, but I think this feature will make the app even more compelling.
 
Cant wait for this feature on the new app! if any chance i could get a beta test version that would be great! im using a jailbroken 3gs, would love to test drive it during my chinese classes
 
coljac said:
I'm one of the other users checking this thread daily for news. I also ordered an iPhone 4 in anticipation of this feature. I wish I had this when I lived in China last year, but am looking forward to putting it through its paces in China next month if the stars are right and the feature makes it into the App Store by then.
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Thanks! Certainly a good chance of that.

bnjmn said:
Cant wait for this feature on the new app! if any chance i could get a beta test version that would be great! im using a jailbroken 3gs, would love to test drive it during my chinese classes
Click to expand...

We're really at our limit for testers now - have our hands full dealing with the number we already have, and we think we've got our post-feedback design pretty well finalized once we finish coding it - but hopefully you won't have too long to wait for the official release.
 
I am wondering if you know the book "Eating Out in China" by Alan Hoenig. If I understand the description of the book correctly, the main part of the book is basically a dictionary listing menu items with their translation. If this book is good I would think adding it as a dictionary in Pleco would be a nice addition to the OCR feature. With the existing dictionaries you can only do a character-by-character translation, but translating complete menu items in one step would be much quicker and more convenient, especially if the waiter is standing behind your back waiting for you to order. Well, just an idea, I do not know how many of the people buying Pleco actually go to China at some point in time and have to eat in restaurants without an english menu. But the book is not that expensive and maybe he would be willing to license it as a pleco dictionary.
 
andreas.koenig said:
I am wondering if you know the book "Eating Out in China" by Alan Hoenig.
Click to expand...

Not familiar with that one... I'm actually liking the idea of adapting McCawley's "The Eater's Guide to Chinese Characters" since it seems to be widely-beloved but out-of-print and we can help make it more available, but this looks like an interesting title along those lines too.
 
mikelove said:
andreas.koenig said:
I am wondering if you know the book "Eating Out in China" by Alan Hoenig.
Click to expand...

Not familiar with that one... I'm actually liking the idea of adapting McCawley's "The Eater's Guide to Chinese Characters" since it seems to be widely-beloved but out-of-print and we can help make it more available, but this looks like an interesting title along those lines too.
Click to expand...

I think the Hoenig book is new. Amazon claims it was released on June 18 (and they have none in stock.) The publisher is ezchinesey.com whose Web page also claims they have a forthcoming volume called "Chinese-English Menu Guide".

McCawley was back in print as of a couple of years ago. But the poor printing and the strange to Chinese-readers/writers organization--for example, 'tian' has 6 strokes in his scheme, and is probably found under "four-stroke enclosures"--make it hard to actually find anything when you need it.

~ Kiran <entropy@io.com>
 
Entropy said:
McCawley was back in print as of a couple of years ago. But the poor printing and the strange to Chinese-readers/writers organization--for example, 'tian' has 6 strokes in his scheme, and is probably found under "four-stroke enclosures"--make it hard to actually find anything when you need it.
Click to expand...

Well that wouldn't be a problem in Pleco, but how do you find that the two compare content-wise?
 
mikelove said:
Entropy said:
McCawley was back in print as of a couple of years ago. But the poor printing and the strange to Chinese-readers/writers organization--for example, 'tian' has 6 strokes in his scheme, and is probably found under "four-stroke enclosures"--make it hard to actually find anything when you need it.
Click to expand...

Well that wouldn't be a problem in Pleco, but how do you find that the two compare content-wise?
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Exactly--in Pleco you'd just search. McCawley seems pretty thorough for something dating to 1984, but apparently since then Sichuan cuisine has taken over most of China, and there's only a little of that in his book. I haven't gotten Hoenig yet, but my friend ordered two copies on Amazon which we should have in a few days. They currently have two in stock--order now! Presumably ezchinesey could give you an electronic form; I expect you'd have to work from paper for McCawley.
 
mikelove said:
andreas.koenig said:
I am wondering if you know the book "Eating Out in China" by Alan Hoenig.
Click to expand...

Not familiar with that one... I'm actually liking the idea of adapting McCawley's "The Eater's Guide to Chinese Characters" since it seems to be widely-beloved but out-of-print and we can help make it more available, but this looks like an interesting title along those lines too.
Click to expand...

I love McCawley's book! I discovered it some time in graduate school and, since then, have always had at least two copies on my shelves (lest I lose one) and I *never* lend them. If there's any help you need with that project, I volunteer.

Also, off-track, but as long as I'm here...Thanks for the explanation about the (mostly) lame programs made for Android. You have a nice historical take on things, so you put them in context.
 
I was definitely wowed by the OCR. I own an earlier version of the ipod touch and was thinking about upgrading to the new camera equipped one purely to gain this feature. I would probably only be using it scan text in magazines or books. Soo I had a few questions because I wasn't quite clear on your response to the previous mentions on this topic.

Is their any chance the OCR would work now that we know the new ipod touch's camera doesn't have autofocus, or would it just work in some limited capacity?
If if could work how long would it be before we saw an ipod touch version of the OCR?

Thanks
 
andrewjr8 said:
I was definitely wowed by the OCR. I own an earlier version of the ipod touch and was thinking about upgrading to the new camera equipped one purely to gain this feature. I would probably only be using it scan text in magazines or books. Soo I had a few questions because I wasn't quite clear on your response to the previous mentions on this topic.

Is their any chance the OCR would work now that we know the new ipod touch's camera doesn't have autofocus, or would it just work in some limited capacity?
If if could work how long would it be before we saw an ipod touch version of the OCR?

Thanks
Click to expand...

I played with the new Ipod touch at an apple store the other day. The camera is not too bad. It was able to focus on text pretty close. (the product description placards on the displays, etc.) And there is a "tap to focus" feature. Im sure compared to the iphone 4 it is crap, but it gave passable images. I bet it would work for larger font type, and signs at least. It would probably have to be marketed as 'experimental' so people wouldnt complain, but I would love to see that! (or at least a still-image version with carefully taken or imported pictures)

对了！I forgot to mention... I tried to install the ipad version of Pleco on an iPad at the apple store, but it seems they have the app-store locked down on the in-store demos units! :? I wanted to see how it looked, and also leave it behind for others to discover! (My wife just got an ipad, so I will have to grovel and try to install pleco on that!)
 
keyclick said:
I played with the new Ipod touch at an apple store the other day. The camera is not too bad. It was able to focus on text pretty close. (the product description placards on the displays, etc.) And there is a "tap to focus" feature.
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It has "Tap to control exposure for video or stills", not focus.

Im sure compared to the iphone 4 it is crap, but it gave passable images. I bet it would work for larger font type, and signs at least. It would probably have to be marketed as 'experimental' so people wouldnt complain, but I would love to see that! (or at least a still-image version with carefully taken or imported pictures)
Click to expand...
A full-price demo add-on. :D I agree Mike should at least seriously consider releasing OCR for the iPod Touch 4 in some manner, but he's right to be concerned with the real quality gap between its camera and the iPhone 3GS/4 autofocus cameras. In my tests with taking pictures of text, I don't think I got it to reliably focus on text smaller than 12-15pt -- a lot of books would be off-limits without an additional focusing lens.
 
I was at the apple store today, and I was able to produce roughly the same image of 12pt text on the iphone as I could on the ipod (NOT EXACT), just by being careful.Granted these weren't Chinese characters but is auto focus really essential to the OCR process?
 
sfrrr said:
I love McCawley's book! I discovered it some time in graduate school and, since then, have always had at least two copies on my shelves (lest I lose one) and I *never* lend them. If there's any help you need with that project, I volunteer.

Also, off-track, but as long as I'm here...Thanks for the explanation about the (mostly) lame programs made for Android. You have a nice historical take on things, so you put them in context.
Click to expand...

Thanks!

andrewjr8 said:
Is their any chance the OCR would work now that we know the new ipod touch's camera doesn't have autofocus, or would it just work in some limited capacity?
If if could work how long would it be before we saw an ipod touch version of the OCR?
Click to expand...

We've got an iPod Touch here for testing and it simply can't resolve characters clearly - the recognizer accuracy is downright terrible with anything smaller than a book cover title (characters < 2 cm or so high, i.e.), it gets very simple characters but it's completely useless with more complicated ones. And looking at the raw video output it's pretty easy to see why.

In theory, we might be able to improve accuracy to the point where the iPod could do OCR if we did some very fancy image-processing work to interpolate between frames (sort of like they do in Red Laser), but it would be incredibly expensive / complicated to develop and it still wouldn't work nearly as well as a device with autofocus. (and our investment would be wasted once the iPod Touch 5G comes out with an 8MP autofocus camera)

dustpuppy said:
any chance of a week end release ? pressure pressure :)
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Not quite that fast - the OCR bit is done but there are a few other critical improvements we're still ironing out. (under-the-hood stuff that absolutely couldn't wait for 2.3)

keyclick said:
I played with the new Ipod touch at an apple store the other day. The camera is not too bad. It was able to focus on text pretty close. (the product description placards on the displays, etc.) And there is a "tap to focus" feature. Im sure compared to the iphone 4 it is crap, but it gave passable images. I bet it would work for larger font type, and signs at least. It would probably have to be marketed as 'experimental' so people wouldnt complain, but I would love to see that! (or at least a still-image version with carefully taken or imported pictures)
Click to expand...

We probably are going to allow it to be purchased / activated on the iPod Touch, and maybe even on the iPad / older iPods for people who want it for its experimental still image support, but there'll be a whole bunch of warnings you'll have to click through - we may even require that you open up the demo version of it and try recognizing a few words, just so there's absolutely no possibility of anyone claiming they didn't know it would be this bad.

kun4 said:
iphone cases with built-in macro lens exist; for instance the "Griffin Clarify". http://www.griffintechnology.com/products/clarifi
If similar cases were to pop up for the ipod touch 4 as well, would this improve OCR?
Click to expand...

Potentially, but we don't know of any on the market for the iPod yet.

andrewjr8 said:
I was at the apple store today, and I was able to produce roughly the same image of 12pt text on the iphone as I could on the ipod (NOT EXACT), just by being careful.Granted these weren't Chinese characters but is auto focus really essential to the OCR process?
Click to expand...

It is - we've done a lot of testing on this with an iPod Touch and it really doesn't deliver satisfactory results with normal-size printed text.
 
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